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Post by bumpnrun on Apr 29, 2012 7:26:09 GMT -8
It appears to me that the lvms spec motor is dead. Does anybody know which if any cars had spec engines last night? All 7 out of town guys don't and looking at the way Gafforini, Rock, Clyne, Burke and Haas come of the corner and down the straight it sure doesn't look like a spec engine. So the Bullring killed the spec engine. How does this make any sense? Another reason to go back to late models or go race at Havasu.
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Post by sg38 on Apr 29, 2012 11:03:17 GMT -8
well Clyne, and myself have Vegas machine lvms spec and Mullis has a Keller spec
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Post by bumpnrun on Apr 29, 2012 11:13:54 GMT -8
Are you sure you it's not your "tour" engine that you ran in the last race last year? If so does tech even look at anything any more. I heard that they don't tech because they don't want to throw anybody out because of the car count. So it's a free for all.
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Post by sg38 on Apr 29, 2012 11:33:25 GMT -8
Ok like i said spec . And Brian is checking . We have to go throughpre tech and declarewhat were running and then we go throughline up tech the hoods are off and they verify the engine and check the cars body Ann wheel track and base . They even poured a new concreteslab for this. And then role over the new scales and after u pass all that you can go to line up. So they are doing a good job
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Post by bumpnrun on Apr 29, 2012 15:25:32 GMT -8
Yea but what do they teardown after the race to see if you have what you said you had going thru pre tech?
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Post by sg38 on Apr 29, 2012 17:24:00 GMT -8
So why u pissed off you asked if anyone was running a spec .. Birdsong makes four. It's not hard if you got iron heads ....and u can see the casting marks of the two styles ----- spec ......aluminium head ---- open ..... 4 barrel ---- ct. 525. The spec engine is just fine with the weight break
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Bumper Bender
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Post by a on Apr 29, 2012 17:32:42 GMT -8
A claimer rule would solve this...
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Post by puertorican on Apr 30, 2012 10:22:07 GMT -8
a,
It's quite clear you don't understand the H.P. to weigh ratio. This is what keeps the playing field pretty level. No need for a claimer rule, if you want that go race in a division that has that rule.
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Post by puertorican on Apr 30, 2012 10:24:02 GMT -8
Scott,
I think Dennis Rock has a Keller spec motor as well, so there is another.
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a
Bumper Bender
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Post by a on Apr 30, 2012 16:48:07 GMT -8
puertorican - HP to weight ratios don't matter if a driver sandbags to hide an illegal motor and tech doesn’t check or know how to check for it (or just don’t care).
The issue is how to get cars back and from what I have heard, a lot of drivers won't race there because they know their motors aren't competitive and they don't want to spend the money (or cheat) just to build/buy a different motor so they can race. As I said, a claimer rule would solve that issue. If you have nothing to hide, then it shouldn't be a problem. I'm sure people will take advantage of it at first, a few will complain, but in time it will mellow out AND the problem is solved.
Of course that may not be the only reason some of the drivers won’t race there, but that is another issue (from my point here).
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Post by puertorican on May 1, 2012 13:27:50 GMT -8
a,
Lame!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Real simple and I'm pretty sure Scotty already said lets do this but here is how you handle it. Every car that wants to run has to go to Wicked HP and run on the chassis dyno. No one from the team my run the car it has to be someone from Wicked HP
(no sand bagging) this way. Then you put weight on each car accordingly. Each motor can then have a seal with numbers installed on any one of the intake bolts and marked down in techs book. In the event you make an engine change you have to run on the dyno again. Problem solved.
Sounds simple now lets just get them to do it! YEA RIGHT!
This would work though.
Instead of calling people cheaters let find a solution to the issue I just provided one lets hear some more.
Come on (a) what you got?
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Post by bumpnrun on May 1, 2012 14:58:58 GMT -8
Who pays for it. LVMS won't. So you want to add another expense to the racers? I thought you are trying to get the car count up. How does adding another expense to the racers help that?
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Bumper Bender
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Post by a on May 1, 2012 18:36:14 GMT -8
I agree with bumpnrun.
Plus you have the issue of everyone having to go to the dyno, as if everyone has the time. What about the cars that are truly from out of town? Now they have to make an extra trip to Vegas (with additional cost to their racing budget) just to run on a dyno? I don't see them wanting to go through that just to race at the bullring.
On top of that, if I owned and expensive piece of machinery, like a racecar, I wouldn't want just anyone jumping in it to max out the engine on a dyno. What happens if a part fails and they blow it up? Who is responsible for it?
You also said that if someone blows a motor and they have a backup, they have to have it dyno’ed before they can race it. Well, as seen during the first race weekend this year, a driver blew the motor in practice on race day. With this rule in effect they would either have to dyno one motor during an off week, change it out and dyno the second (with additional cost) in order to be able to bring it to the track to change it out in that instance. Or I guess they just sit out that race because the backup motor wasn’t put on a dyno before it was run on the track.
Furthermore, what do you do if someone does have 2 motors that are completely different? Assuming they are willing to go through the hassle (and cost) of putting both on a dyno before the run them, how do you manage/track which is in the car at any given time? Maybe one motor is ridiculously down on horsepower but is kept around as a last ditch effort to put in the car in case the first one blows up. Or maybe someone has a crate motor and a spec engine. They normally run the crate motor but that blows up in practice on race day. Now they have to swap motors and make weight changes in order to race? How do you monitor all of that?
Not to mention the teams that are still trying to figure out which motor combination works best. What happens if someone wants to change a cam or something? They have to go through the work of changing it and then the additional work and expenses of taking it to the dyno before they can run it?
Finally, how to you prevent someone from putting a terrible carb on the motor, retarding the timing and whatever else, just to get a bad number on the dyno? Then they go put the good stuff on the motor before they race and they get the weight advantage.
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Bumper Bender
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Post by a on May 1, 2012 18:44:21 GMT -8
BTW puertorican, I am not trying to get into a pissing match with you. We both want the same thing, more cars at the track. There is no need for name calling and antagonistic comments. There is only room for ideas and solutions.
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Post by puertorican on May 2, 2012 13:33:43 GMT -8
a,
At no time did I call anyone names and I also dont think I made any antagonistic comments.
bumpnrun,
I am trying to find a solution and no I don't want to cost anyone more money. But hey here is an idea!
Instead of you two coming on here and shooting down ideas and telling us why it won't work why not come up with an idea that may be a solution.
It's easy to sit back and and say why thing may not work but until you two can provide an idea of your own you two are not worth my time.
See you all at the track in a few weeks when I come to race!
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